IMBA: Possible new direction for the MMBA

[jalopy jockey]

Wow all I can do is shake my head.It seems to me that alot of effort goes into bashing each other instead of informing the less fortunate others who cant make it up to Lansing.Why so much effort on attacks? Instead of just asking a question and simply informing the general members who read these forums for their info?So much bul....sht i cant even imagine becoming more active and THE MMBA wonders why people aren't getting more involved could be the basic vibe that is felt from these type of posts...........Im just callin it the way I read it , not attacking anyone.

The basics have been stated earlier in this thread and tons of communication has occurred at the chapter level. At least it has in Metro North meetings. as well as FAQs on the chapter site. I know my chapter leadership has been been very willing to discuss the information in and out of the meeting as well as email me the program overview and answer any questions not clearly stated within.

There are still some questions out there as to how some state level things will be handled. but the bulk of the decision is the chapters board/member and not really the state board. Therefor some details should not and cannot be discussed here for many reasons. One some who are on here are not MMBA members and therefor not chosen to be impacted and additionally perhaps your chapter will buck the trend and be the only one to or not to become an IMBA chapter.

The basic vibe I get is if you're interested get involved and offer to do something. Those who are doing are too busy running the ship to answer the same question that has been answered many times over and readily available to those who look.

[FrankenFuel95]

I don't remember seeing if this had been posted or not and i don't feel like scrolling through 21 pages...

The IMBA Chapter Program FAQ

[YetiDad]

And you wonder why people don't join this group!!

While Scotty's tone was a little playful to say the least, the way leadership reacted was beyond unprofessional and really is an example of why people don't join. I agree that Scotty can be a PITA but his request for an update was legit. He could not attend the meeting and was looking for info on a very important subject in regards to the future of MMBA. Despite what many of you think, not being able to attend a meeting does not mean you do not do any work or are not involved. It may mean you had a conflict.

I also don't understand why you only share your newsletter with members. Every other forum I belong to that is related to a non-profit sends me as much info as I am willing to receive in hopes that I will see the great things they are doing and send them money. This group makes statements such as become a member and then you will get the newsletter. Businesses pay for email addresses and yet you are not even using the ones people give you for free to expand your influence base and bring people into the fold.

A couple months ago I was trying to decide if it was time to get back into the MMBA and send in my membership dues. I had planned to send them in in January as I was finally at a point both monetarily and time availability to get involved. I started following some of the forum discussion regarding the switch to IMBA to get educated on what was happening and why. I also tried to pull minutes from board meetings to understand what was causing the jobs to be so time intensive. Dauber was nice enough to pm me a couple times to help me get a grasp on the situation but the minutes were less helpful because they are not up to date for the last 7 months. So I am still in the dark.

I know that running a volunteer organization is extremely difficult. I understand that people are hard to get out to help and that a very small number do 99% of the work. I do think if you were a little better at communication and had a more open set up that it would help. One of the questions I asked Dauber(Chris) was what was the mission of the MMBA and he could not give me an answer. Maybe that means it is time for the organization to change and become part of IMBA or maybe it needs to refocus on its core mission of trail access. Either way something needs to change.

Good luck to the leadership of this group it is a very difficult place you are at.

[inasnit]

While Scotty's tone was a little playful to say the least, the way leadership reacted was beyond unprofessional and really is an example of why people don't join. I agree that Scotty can be a PITA but his request for an update was legit. He could not attend the meeting and was looking for info on a very important subject in regards to the future of MMBA. Despite what many of you think, not being able to attend a meeting does not mean you do not do any work or are not involved. It may mean you had a conflict.

Scotty is not "unable" to join the MMBA or attend the meetings, he chooses not to.

[wingzz]

While Scotty's tone was a little playful to say the least, the way leadership reacted was beyond unprofessional and really is an example of why people don't join. I agree that Scotty can be a PITA but his request for an update was legit. He could not attend the meeting and was looking for info on a very important subject in regards to the future of MMBA. Despite what many of you think, not being able to attend a meeting does not mean you do not do any work or are not involved. It may mean you had a conflict.

Scotty is not "unable" to join the MMBA or attend the meetings, he chooses not to.

Well that is kind of a broad statement, do you know what Scotty had planned for Jan 30th?
Maybe he had a conflicting appointment or any number of things that could have prevented him from attending the meeting
sounds kind of snobish stating what Scotty chooses to do and not to do based on nothing more than your opinion

[dennismurphy]

And you wonder why people don't join this group!! While Scotty's tone was a little playful to say the least, the way leadership reacted was beyond unprofessional and really is an example of why people don't join. I agree that Scotty can be a PITA but his request for an update was legit. He could not attend the meeting and was looking for info on a very important subject in regards to the future of MMBA. Despite what many of you think, not being able to attend a meeting does not mean you do not do any work or are not involved.

Our chapter leadership responded to Scotty via email. I don't know that I agree the reaction was unprofessional-
People often don't attend the annual expo, I don't think anyone implied that that indicated lack of commitment to the MMBA

I also don't understand why you only share your newsletter with members. Every other forum I belong to that is related to a non-profit sends me as much info as I am willing to receive in hopes that I will see the great things they are doing and send them money. This group makes statements such as become a member and then you will get the newsletter. Businesses pay for email addresses and yet you are not even using the ones people give you for free to expand your influence base and bring people into the fold.

I can't speak for the board but I think that the mailing is somewhat costly and the board was simply managing expenses. perhaps the other NPOs you get info from have a larger budget to work with? Additionally, very nearly all the MMBA "newsletter" is available online, if I am not mistaken

A couple months ago I was trying to decide if it was time to get back into the MMBA and send in my membership dues. I had planned to send them in in January as I was finally at a point both monetarily and time availability to get involved. I started following some of the forum discussion regarding the switch to IMBA to get educated on what was happening and why. I also tried to pull minutes from board meetings to understand what was causing the jobs to be so time intensive. Dauber was nice enough to pm me a couple times to help me get a grasp on the situation but the minutes were less helpful because they are not up to date for the last 7 months. So I am still in the dark.

The meeting minutes may be out of date but I do think all this information has been disseminated. There are some details yet to be worked out- and I think every board member that chimed in said this as well. This thread has had much information as well. But I will suggest to my chapter leadership that perhaps a good action to take would be to put some bullet points on the main MMBA page... something fairly concise

Maybe that means it is time for the organization to change and become part of IMBA or maybe it needs to refocus on its core mission of trail access. Either way something needs to change.

Actually, I think that the board is looking at the IMBA initiative in order to actually be able TO FOCUS on the core mission. The move to IMBA is not an abandonment of that mission.

The mission of the MMBA is to promote responsible mountain biking and to work toward the goals of common land access and natural resource protection through interaction with policy makers, the cycling industry, race promoters, mountain bikers and other trail users.

[dirt]

While Scotty's tone was a little playful to say the least, the way leadership reacted was beyond unprofessional and really is an example of why people don't join. I agree that Scotty can be a PITA but his request for an update was legit. He could not attend the meeting and was looking for info on a very important subject in regards to the future of MMBA. Despite what many of you think, not being able to attend a meeting does not mean you do not do any work or are not involved. It may mean you had a conflict.

Scotty is not "unable" to join the MMBA or attend the meetings, he chooses not to.

Well that is kind of a broad statement, do you know what Scotty had planned for Jan 30th?
Maybe he had a conflicting appointment or any number of things that could have prevented him from attending the meeting
sounds kind of snobish stating what Scotty chooses to do and not to do based on nothing more than your opinion

..and he can call, email, or personally talk to any of the board members in his chapter. It's HIS choice to not get the information from his chapter.

This is fact, not opinion.

[Scotty]

Scotty is not "unable" to join the MMBA or attend the meetings, he chooses not to.

While I had made it clear for several months that I would wait to renew my membership pending the outcome of the IMBA proposal, it is impossible for YOU to determine why or for what reason I do or do NOT "attend the meetings."

<eyeroll>

[wingzz]

While Scotty's tone was a little playful to say the least, the way leadership reacted was beyond unprofessional and really is an example of why people don't join. I agree that Scotty can be a PITA but his request for an update was legit. He could not attend the meeting and was looking for info on a very important subject in regards to the future of MMBA. Despite what many of you think, not being able to attend a meeting does not mean you do not do any work or are not involved. It may mean you had a conflict.

Scotty is not "unable" to join the MMBA or attend the meetings, he chooses not to.

Well that is kind of a broad statement, do you know what Scotty had planned for Jan 30th?
Maybe he had a conflicting appointment or any number of things that could have prevented him from attending the meeting
sounds kind of snobish stating what Scotty chooses to do and not to do based on nothing more than your opinion

..and he can call, email, or personally talk to any of the board members in his chapter. It's HIS choice to not get the information from his chapter.

This is fact, not opinion.

dont twist this around, Marty made a statement about what Scotty had time for it had nothing to do with "..and he can call, email, or personally talk to any of the board members in his chapter"

[dirt]

While Scotty's tone was a little playful to say the least, the way leadership reacted was beyond unprofessional and really is an example of why people don't join. I agree that Scotty can be a PITA but his request for an update was legit. He could not attend the meeting and was looking for info on a very important subject in regards to the future of MMBA. Despite what many of you think, not being able to attend a meeting does not mean you do not do any work or are not involved. It may mean you had a conflict.

Scotty is not "unable" to join the MMBA or attend the meetings, he chooses not to.

Well that is kind of a broad statement, do you know what Scotty had planned for Jan 30th?
Maybe he had a conflicting appointment or any number of things that could have prevented him from attending the meeting
sounds kind of snobish stating what Scotty chooses to do and not to do based on nothing more than your opinion

..and he can call, email, or personally talk to any of the board members in his chapter. It's HIS choice to not get the information from his chapter.

This is fact, not opinion.

dont twist this around, Marty made a statement about what Scotty had time for it had nothing to do with "..and he can call, email, or personally talk to any of the board members in his chapter"

It has ALL had to do with his desire to have the answers handed to him personally, because he is UNWILLING to simply seek the answers from his chapter.

The MMBA is NOT joining IMBA, his CHAPTER is.

[Scotty]

It has ALL had to do with his desire to have the answers handed to him personally, because he is UNWILLING to simply seek the answers from his chapter.

That is completely FALSE.

I've spoken directly or via email with no less than 7 people in the past 5 days. Several of them from my chapter and the rest being people who attended the EXPO.

You guys are making yourself look like idiots.

I suggest you stop making claims to my motivations, thoughts, etc. and (especially if you're an MMBA officer) just let it go.

People who aren't in the cool kids clique might actually wander into this thread to get information. They'll find out that if they don't attend every meeting or if they ask a question online they might get a hundred personal attacks in response. What a great recruitment exercise!

[inasnit]

It has ALL had to do with his desire to have the answers handed to him personally, because he is UNWILLING to simply seek the answers from his chapter.

That is completely FALSE.

I've spoken directly or via email with no less than 7 people in the past 5 days. Several of them from my chapter and the rest being people who attended the EXPO.

You guys are making yourself look like idiots.

I suggest you stop making claims to my motivations, thoughts, etc. and (especially if you're an MMBA officer) just let it go.

People who aren't in the cool kids clique might actually wander into this thread to get information. They'll find out that if they don't attend every meeting or if they ask a question online they might get a hundred personal attacks in response. What a great recruitment exercise!

What information are you looking for that hasn't already been discussed to exhaustion ?

[dirt]

It has ALL had to do with his desire to have the answers handed to him personally, because he is UNWILLING to simply seek the answers from his chapter.

That is completely FALSE.

I've spoken directly or via email with no less than 7 people in the past 5 days. Several of them from my chapter and the rest being people who attended the EXPO.

You guys are making yourself look like idiots.

I suggest you stop making claims to my motivations, thoughts, etc. and (especially if you're an MMBA officer) just let it go.

People who aren't in the cool kids clique might actually wander into this thread to get information. They'll find out that if they don't attend every meeting or if they ask a question online they might get a hundred personal attacks in response. What a great recruitment exercise!

Then I guess I was just confused why, knowing that the information would be coming from the chapter, and that this was a chapter decision for your chapter, you would be asking the question here.

I'll apologize for my responses. But, the fact is, the chapters are making the decisions. To find out how this would affect you, you need to talk to them. Each chapter is looking at this decision separably, as each chapter is the entity that will be applying to be an IMBA chapter.

The MMBA, on the other hand, is dealing with a totally separate issue, and that being, deciding the form that the MMBA will continue in when it's a stand alone organization, existing without chapters. Chapters may be members of the MMBA, but they won't BELONG to the MMBA. The board decision was to hand the individual decisions to the chapters, and investigate it's future model and role.

And, I'll be honest. Many of the board members are tired, stressed and burnt out. I know for myself, I choose to continue, because I didn't feel it was right to bail on this half way through the process, no matter which way it goes. It's been a difficult year, both heading into this decision, and now working out way through it. I'll admit that not always respond to what I feel are leading or loaded questions badly, but I'm only human. Maybe even an *beep* at times. But, it's VERY difficult to try to work through what I feel, personally, is the right thing for the organization, yet be attacked and judged ever time you speak. I'm far from perfect.

The focus of this decision is at the chapters right now. We've worked hard to get the information to the chapter leadership, so that they can evaluate and make the decisions. Most of the board members are focusing on the chapters right now. It is, by far, the best place to get information. Marty has made an effort to put some of the main questions and answers on our chapter website, but I know other chapters are working on doing the same thing.

[Di_bear]

The meeting minutes may be out of date but I do think all this information has been disseminated. There are some details yet to be worked out- and I think every board member that chimed in said this as well. This thread has had much information as well. But I will suggest to my chapter leadership that perhaps a good action to take would be to put some bullet points on the main MMBA page... something fairly concise

Marty has been writing FAQs for her chapter and she told me about this at the expo. She has forwarded some to me and I plan to form them into an FAQ for the website. It will not get done this week. I'm working on another project right now and I need to wind down a bit from the expo. It seems very true that 1% do 99% of the work. I hope no one takes this as "the MMBA not caring" or "the MMBA conspiring to keep people in the dark." The reality is that it is the MMBA trying to get a lot done while preventing burnout. I felt burned out last November and December and took a step back.

Maybe that means it is time for the organization to change and become part of IMBA or maybe it needs to refocus on its core mission of trail access. Either way something needs to change.

Actually, I think that the board is looking at the IMBA initiative in order to actually be able TO FOCUS on the core mission. The move to IMBA is not an abandonment of that mission. We don't have the specifics of what we're doing with the MMBA. We know we plan to keep the MMBA around, but, as Nate has put it, we're farming out some of the work, especially that which requires more dedication and knowledge than what a volunteer board can give.

Unfortunately, we had to embark on the IMBA application process before we could figure out the specifics of the MMBA, and that is where we are now. I've said it many times, and I said it in one of my last posts in this thread. THAT is part of the reason why people are a little edgy, because we've said the same things many times and no one seems to take the time to actually read our posts. I'll be surprised if most of you make it as far as this line. (Disclaimer: I'm not being *beep* here, but I'm stating a fact. I've put out information for the incoming board members in the newsletters and confirmed that they do indeed receive the newsletters, yet some of them had no idea how to do a very basic thing that they all needed to take 10 seconds to do. I've also posted this info on the forum to no avail. This is a problem that is common throughout the whole organization, including members and even those non-members who frequent this forum.)

The mission of the MMBA is to promote responsible mountain biking and to work toward the goals of common land access and natural resource protection through interaction with policy makers, the cycling industry, race promoters, mountain bikers and other trail users.

Thank you, Dennis. This is straight from the website on the Information and Programs/About page off of the main page. We also have a Site Map listed off of the main page so you can more easily find what you are looking for. Please take the time to look at the website. We don't do this for our health. We do it to inform you, so please use the tools that we've put a lot of time into developing for you. Mind you, this is a process, and I will be working with Marty and anyone else with valuable input to place an IMBA FAQ on the site.

[dauber76]

One of the questions I asked Dauber(Chris) was what was the mission of the MMBA and he could not give me an answer.

I apologize if I did not answer that question. As posted a bit earlier in the thread, our mission statement is, "...to promote responsible mountain biking and to work toward the goals of common land access and natural resource protection through interaction with policy makers, the cycling industry, race promoters, mountain bikers and other trail users."

Over the past ~2 years more and more time of the MMBA state board has been spent working on issues that did not directly do what is listed above. We spent time dealing with insurance issues and criminal sexual misconduct policies and other similar "business" related tasks. Once key function of the IMBA chapter program is that more time will be freed up to focus again on our mission statement, since IMBA will be taking care of most of our administrative tasks.

If you want the quick, down-and-dirty, version of why we are looking to potentially partner with IMBA, that is why.